SR Molecule Man: Cheeseburger Eater (145MSW) question

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SR Molecule Man: Cheeseburger Eater (145MSW) question

Postby weapono » Thu Jun 08, 2023 4:34 pm

Hello WKRF -

Your recent answer to Jackalopespam's Invulnerability's question prompts me to ask a question about the SR Molecule Man: Cheeseburger Eater from Secret Wars, who's text reads…
While Molecule Man is active, your spidey friend characters cost 1 less to field, cost 1 less to purchase, and return to the field Zone after they deal combat damage to your opponent.

Just for clarity, while a player has Molecule Man active, any of that players spidey friend characters that go unblocked and deal combat damage to the opponent would return to the field at level one because they would have to first pass through out of play (unrolled state), correct? Or does this ability circumvent out of play and they would return to the field on the same level they were on when they went unblocked?

What about if you were to give those dice overcrush with something like Thrown Car and they were KO'd but did combat damage because of the overcrush? I'm assuming that would fall under the Invulnerability ruling guidance and return them to the field at level 1 because they would first pass through an unrolled state in the prep area? Or again, would Molecule Man's ability circumvent them from ever moving to the Prep Area?

And just for completeness, say a spidey friend character goes through unblocked but has 0 attack, would that count as dealing combat damage? If no, would it return to the field?

Thanks in advance.

Here's a link to the invulnerability ruling…
https://win.wizkids.com/bb/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=16621&sid=ff9f2379bf75b38c7b7b599661ad12ab
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Re: SR Molecule Man: Cheeseburger Eater (145MSW) question

Postby dmrulesteam » Fri Jun 09, 2023 12:06 pm

Just for clarity, while a player has Molecule Man active, any of that players spidey friend characters that go unblocked and deal combat damage to the opponent would return to the field at level one because they would have to first pass through out of play (unrolled state), correct? Or does this ability circumvent out of play and they would return to the field on the same level they were on when they went unblocked?

The intent of Molecule Man’s ability circumvents the Out of Play area and is an exception to Rule 2.7.4.3.1 (cited below). Therefore, that die will return to the Field Zone on its same level. An unblocked Spider-Man Family affiliated die would deal its combat damage, then move from the Attack Zone to the Field Zone before the next sub-step of the Attack Step (Apply “when damaged” Abilities) starts.

General Discussion
Dice located in the Out of Play area are not considered to be in either a rolled or unrolled game state. Since dice in this area cannot interact with any other abilities, it is irrelevant to consider this game state (i.e. being rolled or unrolled). For all intents and purposes, dice in the Out of Play area have no impact on game play during the Active player’s turn.

What about if you were to give those dice overcrush with something like Thrown Car and they were KO'd but did combat damage because of the overcrush? I'm assuming that would fall under the Invulnerability ruling guidance and return them to the field at level 1 because they would first pass through an unrolled state in the prep area? Or again, would Molecule Man's ability circumvent them from ever moving to the Prep Area?

A Spider-Man Family affiliated die would follow the same resolution as stated above, circumventing the Prep Area (or Used Pile if applicable) in this case.

And just for completeness, say a spidey friend character goes through unblocked but has 0 attack, would that count as dealing combat damage? If no, would it return to the field?

No and no. While the act of assigning combat damage occurred, no damage was dealt. Therefore, an unblocked Spider-Man Family affiliated die that dealt 0 damage would not be covered by Molecule Man’s ability (sorry Aunt May).

Rule 2.7.4.3.1 Each attacker that is unblocked will assign combat damage equal to its Attack value directly to the Inactive player (reducing that player’s Life total accordingly) and that attacker will move Out of Play before any other abilities would resolve. The only exceptions are abilities that may prevent, reduce, or redirect that attacker’s damage. This means that the unblocked attacker leaves the Attack (Field) Zone after all damage is calculated and assigned but before any “when a player takes combat damage” abilities or any other damage resolves. Hence, any “while active” ability this Character die has can no longer be applied and this unblocked attacker cannot be the target of any subsequent abilities.
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Re: SR Molecule Man: Cheeseburger Eater (145MSW) question

Postby jackalopespam » Fri Jun 09, 2023 12:43 pm

Regarding the Overcrush situation. Since the die circumvents the Prep Area, is that die still considered to have been KO'd for other game effects? Likewise, is it considered to have been damaged?
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Re: SR Molecule Man: Cheeseburger Eater (145MSW) question

Postby dmrulesteam » Mon Jun 12, 2023 3:32 pm

Regarding the Overcrush situation. Since the die circumvents the Prep Area, is that die still considered to have been KO'd for other game effects? Likewise, is it considered to have been damaged?

Yes and yes. The particular die is considered to have been damaged and/or KO’d and will trigger “when/if KO’d” or “when/if damaged” abilities appropriately.
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